There were a lot of good posts yesterday about the economy and local jobs.
The jobs are not of the high paying variety, most are at $10 an hour or less, many less.
Creekstone, Kanpack and Skyline (the place that makes mobile homes) are all looking for people. They have a couple of good paying jobs, but mostly its not higher end jobs.
So maybe we do need more Mexicans.
But the dollar does go further here. As editor of the paper, i make less here than i did in south carolina as a reporter. But the money goes further here. Had it not been for family situations, I would not have considered moving here.
Taxes are higher here, but everything else is less.
The trend on the blog is just like the trend in conversation at any gathering, or among city and county officials.
We need higher paying jobs, but to get them you have to have companies that can pay that. Those companies will not come here unless there is a labor force readily available.
So you have to have the people. Its a never ending circle.
This is why the bike trail is important. It is one piece of the puzzle that improves quality of life, which attracts people to move here, which in turn could help attract a business here...
The school bond issue is another. I don' want to pay more taxes any more than anyone else does, but ... I don't see any alternative.
Sounds kinda convoluted, but that is how it seems to work.
Then people get frustrated and quit cause its so hard to make happen, and nearly impossible if you are not offering very nice incentives to the company as well - they get those incentives everywhere else, so without them you are not even in the game.
There must be an answer to this.
Maybe the answer isnt more jobs?
Maybe the answer is in re-inventing the town.
What if we did become a place that people wanted to come to?
This is what was meant at the city meeting the other night when the re-branding of the town idea was mentioned. Now dont get excited about that. It was one of about 30 ideas mentioned, and was not even top 10 material.
I think im more interested in the idea than the city is.
But just think of the possibilities.
Tiny town of Helen, Ga., just a wide spot in the road, is now an alpine village with that whole theme running throughout the town. Its a tourist place now, and crowded even.
THere's many more examples. Branson, Mo. , Dollywood, Tenn.,
Would take some visionaries, but ...
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"Would take some visionaries, but ..."
OK: fair enough. With a few exceptions the major problems have been identified. I won't count them out. They're on the blog.
Helen and Branson will take many millions $ of investment. Any takers? Where to get them?
Some of these problems, ie.: housing and jobs, could cancel each other out if done right.
There are a number of untapped potentials, ie. a restaurant that could be re-opened, Walnut Park river access, jobs to be filled etc.
The cure is to take a step. It can't be superficial. And has to be followed through.
Then another.
What is the first step?
i think the first step is to just do something.
Im not sure it even matters what.
If we can get one or two people doing something, it might inspire more people to do something.
Doesnt even matter if it fails.
Just as long as its someone trying something.
I know someone who is trying very hard to get a new skate park for the local skaters... she is working her tail off.
There isn't a skate park in any of the outlaying towns so I think it is great!
The skaters have pledged to make good grades and will be attending tutoring sessions with Cowley College students at the library.
Hopefully, they will be able to get support from the local community.
i know that person too :)
that is something.
hopefully it will work out.
Now, we need more of that.
______________________________
from another thread
______________________________
300 jobs a myth?
I keep hearing CVB and Cowley First. Though the information is posted here almost daily, those in doubt could call.
CVB: 442-0230
Cowley First: 442-3094
Want to solve our problems? Quit doubting and take action.
_________________________________
One visionary to a thousand doubters and we might have a chance.
I want to throw a concept at you not to preach - but to get your thoughts!
"We simply live and exist in the Seams". We always have!
We are a rural area - we have access to things in the bigger more populated areas but our agriculture base and population doesn't allow us to claim those
same options.
We have some technical/skilled labor jobs but most are unskilled. Lower paying jobs that are easily lost to competition from within and outside our area. ex. Tellers at the banks can make more at the Casinos!
I agree with some of the ideas that are targeted at bringing people from the metropolitan areas to our area - we have seen the success of the Walnut Valley Festival - Ark City Fall Festival and Parade and The Last Run!
Our industries while some are by larger companies - GE, ADM, Morton Building, Fluid Kinetics and Rubbermaid - which are headquartered outside the area-
but the others are ones that were
started by local individuals and investors. Consumer Products - Rubbermaid which was originally Gott - KSQ now Western Mfg. Creek Stone which was Praireland etc.
They exist in the seams! The area that falls in between - some by logistics - some by design - some simply by chance!
So I want to challenge you to think beyond comparing to other areas!
"What could thrive in the Seams"?
Ex. I am simply amazed at how Henry's candy store stays open in Dexter! (That the O'Henry candy bar was originally created in Dexter).
I still stand by my post on the cost of bringing in or creating a sub-culture you get the good and the bad!
One visionary to a thousand doubters and we might have a chance.
>>>
Sounds like fair odds to me, the doubters wont ever do anything anyway, so .... on person has em outnumbered :)
"The seams" is an interesting idea
a good place to start thinking.
the internet has also changed the way the world thinks, and that might be part of the picture too.
It seems to me that there are many many things that can be done to get Ark City jump-started, starting with industrial development, filling unfilled jobs, use jobs to build affordable housing, develop river projects, parks, shopping, etc (and not necessarily in that order).
I wonder, if we all looked back 6 months, if the perception was to be able to change Ark City or not.
There is a lot to do, and it CAN be done.
Don't shoot the guys who seem negative. Give them a hammer. Everybody wants it better. The only difference is how to go about it.
"Ex. I am simply amazed at how Henry's candy store stays open in Dexter! (That the O'Henry candy bar was originally created in Dexter)."
The Entrepreneurship City????
S&Y in Winfield was started in the owner's garage they now employ 70-80 people.
Fostering the ability for people to take a chance and not have to rely on a $6.00-$10.00 an hour job could be a great stimulator.
How about creating a business incubator in the empty USD 470 building? The city can offer subsidized office space while helping theme to find financing and other resources.
Entrepreneurship was once what made Ark City great. Did you know during the Cherokee Strip Land run they lobbied for two posts because they knew they would have more people came through. They also marketed the city. It was the only town with two registration booths and, therefore, became the largest starting off point.
Tom Henry invented the O'Henry Candy bar while working in Ark City.
"Though the information is posted here almost daily, those in doubt could call."
That's kind of a roundabout answer. Not doubting, just asking. Are there 300 jobs or not?
lots of cool businesses started in someone's garage..
who will be next ?
the 300 is a figure i hear flown about by people who should know ... cowley first, county and city officials etc.,
This is straight from the Cowley First Website from December 2007 so pretty current.
Cowley County Labor Surplus and Shortage Reports:
(Data from Kansas JobLink Career Information System)
Labor Shortages Report: December 2007
Number of Available
Job Seekers Job Openings
Production 281 435
That is just for production. In other areas it seems there are more job seekers then jobs.
That didn't come through very well but in short:
job seekers = 281
job openings = 485
And from their site the wages for Production workers:
Low = $6.63
High = $10.33
So you can assume for the most part that the 485 available jobs are those paying less than $10.00/hr.
And if anyone would like to look at the data themselves here is the link:
http://www.cowleyfirst.com/
new_page_3.htm
and these are only the jobs listed through Kansas Job Link?
Did they have any information as to what jobs there might be that are not listed on Kansas Job Link?
Man I hope this is not the basis of this whole escapade.
Going to the joblink and selecting Cowley County DOES list 410 jobs. So there is the PROOF. !!!!
Problem is when you select Cowley County, it shows all the jobs in Wichita.
There were 28 jobs listed in Ark City and 16 in Winfield.
We gotta be smarter about this stuff.
I am not sure that these are necessarily just posted on Kansas jobs link. I only saw about 20+ jobs listed but some of those were for multiple positions.
So, I guess there could be more but I think these are the numbers for local industry.
Any other jobs would probably be just one or two here or there.
Maybe not...
You are right based on the job search engine that would be what you come up with... and that does include Wichita. There must be some problem with their system.
I can't speak for how Cowley First got the number for their report.
You do have to realize that some of those listings are for multiple positions.
"(Data from Kansas JobLink Career Information System)"
That's what was said. If anybody has firm information that this wasn't the source, then please let it be known.
Who are these businesses with 300 jobs in Ark City?
It doesn't make sense. If there are only about 320 jobs listed in Wichita, then how are there 300 jobs in Ark City.
Garbage In equals Garbage Out.
It is really important to make sure that data has integrity before plugging it into other documents and making decisions based on the results.
Check the facts.
So maybe there are 30 or 40 open jobs in Ark City?
Well if the previous poster, would have spent 5 minutes on the site instead of trying to correlate the job search with the numbers for the report they would have found the answer.
If you look to the left there is a section called career info and from there you can access a whole bunch of reports.
You can search for just Cowley County. And I checked to make sure the Wichita numbers were not included in the report by looking at several different job descriptions under Production. There were jobs listed in Wichita with openings and in Cowley those same jobs showed no openings.
Now, I can't confirm the number because I am not going to take the time to go through all the production numbers and add them up... but at the very least it was showing 90 available production line jobs with an hourly average wage of $10.64.
Well, if you choose labor shortage it gives you 356 production jobs.
Again, I can't verify the accuracy of those numbers but I am sure this is were how they came to the 300 jobs number.
"Well if the previous poster, would have spent 5 minutes on the site.."
and
"Now, I can't confirm the number because I am not going to take the time..."
Which is it?
On the surface it appears that a report prepared for indicating a labor shortage used an erroneous database search to come up with numbers that were way off.
It doesn't help anything to argue that it isn't 435 or 485 or 356 0r 300 or 90 or whatever number without actually getting some supporting backup from specific employers that indicate which employer has which jobs available.
Considering the fact that a search of joblink (which was indicated as the source for the report's data) erroneously indicates hundreds of Wichita jobs when only Cowley County was selected, and that these figures are similar to those quoted in the report, these statements are doubtful.
Jobs are not statistics. They are jobs.
If there is not an employer that lists a specific job it just does not exist.
You can't play fast and loose with numbers. Use at least the skepticism one would use when preparing a high school report when researching these numbers.
List the employer, contact name and job description and availability dates. Add them up and you have the real data.
Otherwise 485 jobs? 28 jobs? Who knows?
Until there is factual information, nobody should be going around stating any numbers or planning anything based on the 300 job figure.
Vanna, can we buy a fact (not vowel)?
"There were jobs listed in Wichita with openings and in Cowley those same jobs showed no openings."
A search of Wichita showed about 700 jobs and a search of Cowley showed about 300 Wichita jobs. So all Wichita jobs are not shown on a Cowley search.
You can't take a "Wichita" search and subtract the Wichita jobs from the "Cowley" search and say the 400 remaining jobs are in Cowley County. They could be in Hutch, Newton or McPherson as likely as they could be in Ark City. The logic doesn't work.
The only jobs in Ark City are the jobs in Ark City. period.
Okay, so I did find out some information.
Rubbermaid at one point was hiring 100-200 people and Creekstone was hiring about 100 people so that is where the 300 job number that was floating around came from.
Obviously, the number is going to fluctuate but these were real jobs with these employers.
The numbers from the Kansas Job link are still unverified but I e-mailed them to find out.
And all of this because every single one of you is too lazy to dial the numbers in the previous post.
A 5 minute call would have given a total and complete answer. Why didn't it happen? Because we don't want an answer.
What's wrong with Ark City?
There it is folks!
I actually did call... why didn't you? If it is so upsetting to you?
BTW, calling wouldn't have changed the numbers that were given on the website. Those are the numbers that are publicly cited. So, it doesn't do any good to chastise people for not calling as it wouldn't have changed the outcome. You would have had to press further.
I had to call both Kansas Job Link and Cowley First to get an exact answer.
The 100-200 jobs at Rubbermaid and the 100 jobs at Creekstone are real.
The other jobs listed on Kansas Link are real but employers are allowed to put in a range of zip codes so if they think someone from Cowley County will travel for the job then they will put Cowley County on their list of zip codes.
The number is off the website is just hard to verify for a multitude of reasons, however, they do speak directly with employers. And so does Workforce.
"The 100-200 jobs at Rubbermaid and the 100 jobs at Creekstone are real."
Thanks. Something concrete. Finally.
Did they say they were still hiring, or was that some time ago.
If Creekstone needs 100 and Rubbermaid needs 200, then that is something that can be promoted!!!
Yes, they are still hiring. Rubbermaid did have classified ads up within the last week or so. I don't see them now. Creekstone is one of the companies listed on the Kansas Job Link.
Don't know for sure if it is still that high of a number but the Cowley First people did say that there was a worker shortage.
Excellent. It would be interesting to know a firm number of just how many new employees would be currently needed, maybe broken down by employer.
In any case at 8 bucks per hour 100 people bring $1.6 million/yr into the local economy. Seems like the best first growth.
100 people need 100 houses, 400 loaves of bread, 6,000 gallons of gas per month, 12,000 tortillas, etc. etc. etc.
Why is it we don't see this information in the Traveler? Is haveing 300 jobs open in the area worth a headline? Why does it seem to be a secret?
I wonder how much it costs to advertise these jobs? Why the companies don't get any responses?
Why do people complain about not finding any jobs when there are so many available? What are we missing that these jobs aren't filled?
Who is supposed to come up with the answers for this stuff?
The jobs are being advertised. As I stated before Rubbermaid has had a classified ad in the local paper just as recently as last week. They also use staffing firms and work with the local Workforce Develeopment office.
Creekstone is listed on Kansas Jobs link and they have also had some advertisements.
The thing about these jobs and why they are hard to fill is that they are very tough work for very little pay. I am sure that there is a revolving door on the production line of both Creekstone and Rubbermaid. That is just the reality of the situation. If they were high paying production jobs you probably wouldn't hear about worker shortages.
Cowley's unemployment rate is pretty low (3.9%) so apparently there are better jobs to be had elsewhere in the county.Or people move out of the county for better opportunities.
Does anyone know if the majority of current workers at Creekstone live within the county? James mentioned something about Creekstone possibly busing people in from Wichita..that was never confirmed.
The hispanic population of Ark City is about 4.5% vs. Wichita's 9.6%. We just may not have enough of the type of demographic that fills those types of positions and, therefore, they bus people in from Wichita.
From what I hear, it is hard to get people in that wage range, who can pass a drug test.
(I better not get started on rights to privacy etc. :) )
And, if you were living in Wichita, Ponca, or somehwere like that, you might not be thinking of moving to Arkansas City for a $8 a hour job.
I think thats a lot of the problem. Moving is expensive.
We dont have the things here to attract kids just out of high school, so they dont move here.
It is kind of a chicken or egg thing, but we really do have to work on getting people to move here.
At the same time, we need to get higher paying jobs. But to get that we have to work on quality of life issues and housing.
So we have a lot of work to do.
But it can be done.
What about jobs from some of our other employers?
Kan-Pak
KSQ
Good Times
Northern Contours
GE
Hawkeye
and all the rest?
Some of these pay pretty good wages. Some may not need employees, but I'm sure most do.
We have jobs, why don't we have the people? And if we can't fill the jobs we have now, why pay to bring in more industry?
If we had more stores, more hike/bike trails, a river development, more restaurants, and the things that have been talked about.... Would that bring people to fill the jobs?
Or do we need something else? More apartments? More new homes? A better community? Or just more advertising?
"And if we can't fill the jobs we have now, why pay to bring in more industry?"
Good point, but 2 different issues. Ark City needs to change policy that any new industry is part of the tax base. Only way to do that is to become involved in the process rather than let others do it.
"If we had more stores, more hike/bike trails, a river development, more restaurants, and the things that have been talked about.... Would that bring people to fill the jobs?"
I think this is the most important question that has been asked on any of these blogs. We should take it very seriously and answer it.
This is definitely not my answer to the question, just comments:
There seems to be a resistance to immigrant workers. It might be a good idea to talk to some of the Creekstone workers and see how they view Ark City.
Maybe we should "walk through" the process that someone goes through when they move to town and make sure there isn't some unintended barrier that unnecessarily kills moves.
How do people get housing, mortgages, etc. and how friendly is that process?
I noticed one of the Rubbermaid ads was for a bilingual marketing manager, definitely not an entry level position.
Maybe the idea to have a fluent spanish speaking friendly face at the city or chamber is not such a terrible idea. It is a sure thing that more jobs at Creekstone means more hispanics.
Apparently filling those jobs means recruiting.
The one thing I'm really surprised about is how difficult it is to get straight answers on issues in Ark City.
With all the people employed in the county in the realm of employment and training you would think the answer might be on the order of:
"There are 135 jobs available this week: X at Creekstone, Y at Rubbermaid Z at Good Times. This is a change of 21 from last week where 15 jobs were posted, and 12 jobs were filled."
Instead, people just get mad and evasive.
In order to make it work there has to be a little smarter approach to it.
"15 jobs were posted, and 12 jobs were filled."
Try again: 33 posted and 12.
(maybe I could be smarter too :0 )
I remember when Centerville closed in mid 2006, Rubbermaid announced the addition of 200 jobs, but I thought most of those were filled. I understand Creekstone employees are operating part time now, so I wonder if the 100 jobs is a current number, but someone should be able to have a quick correct, exact answer about the real numbers, one way or another.
I have 30 openings at the moment, I pay just a tad bit less than minimum wage and cant find any help. I do not undersand why people do not want these jobs, the government will subsidise these workers with food stamps and houseing allowance,, That way the tax payers do not need to support them,, JUst like the sign at Rvier City Auto says 50% PAID BY TAXS THE OTHER PART PAID BY THE STATE WHAT A DEAL,,, I really belive in the american way and want to see everyone supporting those with less education,,, lets bring more low paid workers here and make this city shine with slums and low economic lifestyles,, maybe they can all live next door to YOU?
Don't have to bring 'em in.
Shall we give the unqualified, uneducated, unwilling to work the top paying jobs we have now? What do we do with those people? Escort them out of town?
Why are people being bussed in from Wichita to work at Creekstone if the job market is so wonderful there?
We need to step out of the dream world and into the real world. The problem is not the city, the county, nor the employers.
"Why are people being bussed in from Wichita to work at Creekstone if the job market is so wonderful there?"
Don't know. I'll bet if we found out, we would know something we don't know now.
Why doesn't somebody ask them?
It seems it would be an awful lot of trouble to put up with bussing for a job.
I know a lot of people commute from Wichita to GE too. Why is that?
If we knew and paid attention to the answer, maybe that could be important.
Or not.
Otherwise the answer is soylent green. ;)
Ever shop for housing in AC? Try it. It will open your eyes.
David Allen stated the school bond will be 60 million after all.
Go figure.
on the school bond issue, the actual cost will be around 60 million, once you pay the interest.
just like a house loan. if you buy a house at $100,000 on a 30 year note, you will pay around $200,000 over the time period.
This may not be a complete answer but I believe it is part of the equation.
This was a result of a very well designed study with American Journal of Agricultural Economics.
"One benefit of industry growth is it raises overall employment growth in the county. Khan, Orazem, and Otto (2001) conclude that jobs are more important than wages for rural population growth, and so there may be some value for rural economic developers to encourage local expansion of the MPP industry. However, the net effects of positive job growth are muted by the negative wage growth from the expansion of meat packing, and aggregate income growth in the county is neither enhanced nor retarded by increasing the share of meat packing in the local economy. These mixed results suggest that the overall economic benefit from MPP expansion to a rural community is likely to be only modestly positive."
Basically, they pretty much say that it doesn't really have a much of a negative or positive effect on the community.
So looking for growth to come from the jobs at Creekstone is probably not the answer.
If you would like to read the study here is the link:
http://www.entrepreneur.com/tradejournals/
article/167430018_4.html
I have seen some of the ads for employment liste in the paper.
I have also talked to some of the people who have placed those ads, and some of the people who worked there (one in specific).
When you are hiring for a position, and one of the requirements is to be able to come to work clean and sober, and be able to prove it,(buy what ever test is necessary).
To be able to read a tape measure, buy incase you weren't aware there are two ends to a tape measure, and one of them isn't all that hard to read.
In retail, the most common complaint that I hear is," the clerks can't make change, or they don't count your change back to you, that is a pet peve of mine also. Most of the time, the look at the register pull out the money and put it in your hand, some say,"thank you". Most don't pay any attention.
Many of the people who are looking for jobs, want to start at the top. Highest pay, best benifits, longest vacations and on and on.
I can't remember when I ever started out at the top.
Every job I ever took, had an entry wage, which increased as I earned it by being on time, learning the job, be willing to do a little extra without being asked, and in some cases without being paid for it. I didn't feel like I was being taken advantage of, because it all came back most of the time several times over.
We all do things in our lives that we don't particularly care for or want to do to get along.
If that is where you are in your life, it isn't going to get any better setting around and crying about it.
"on the school bond issue, the actual cost will be around 60 million, once you pay the interest."
One poster asked why some things weren't front page news. It's clear that the Traveler is a proponent of the school bond, but there is an issue that should be explored. The Traveler will look really out of touch if there is a problem here and they didn't report it.
Someone needs to do an independent accounting of the taxes to pay for this.
There are 5,628 housing units in Ark City.
If every single housing unit was worth $75,000 and each paid $35.00 per year, that would net $196,980.00 per year.
One half of 60 million (Ark City's part) divided by twenty years equals 1.5 million per year.
Is there someone other than residential property holders going to be paying the 86% share?
It is a rough estimate, but there is a huge difference between $196,000 and $1.5 million.
It doesn't look like the estimates are right.
Once this is approved, whether the estimates were right or wrong, there is no do-over. Let's get it right going in.
What is the real number that property owners will have to pay, and are we sure?
One thing to keep in mind is that Unified school District 470 is not just Arkansas City. It even includes the fine folks in Parkerfield, Silverdale and the other outlying townships and county residents who are within the boundary of USD470. Clearly, the influence of the interest paid over twenty years was not presented. However, I think the local share costs are pretty close to accurate. While the opportunity to have all taxpayers in Kansas share in the cost of our building improvements for USD470 is appealing, we must also recognize that any one of the 500+ other communities could launch a similar initiative and we would share in their costs. It's state money but we all contribute and all Kansans have access to it under the same rules. That is one side.
The other is that the state could either raise taxes to allow for more school districts to follow this pattern in the future or declare that no funds are available for such projects.
If we delayed the proposal, it could cost more and the at-large contribution from the state could be less.
To the earlier discussion on open jobs in the county. There too is an opportunity for innovation. Rather than trying to fill a few hundred positions at modest but fair wages, the businesses could use their expertise to re-engineer the work so that the current staffing levels could meet the demand AND redistribute the payroll allocated for new hires towards the existing workforce.
The can design the work so that it can be safely done, boost the median wage in the county and, as a fringe benefit, increase labor market appeal for the future by having a higher base wage for future hires. Where will always be attrition through voluntary or involuntary separation from the employers.
Most of the fortune 500's have significantly reduced head count and boosted performance while also reducing employee turnover via enhanced compensation and benefit packages. More rewarding profit sharing packages and stock options are innovative ways that employers have entreated workers to accept more responsibility and duty.
Our area employers need to think in terms of what they have for payroll without always following the same pattern of more work means more people.
When head counts become more stable, the need to downsize in future tight margin periods is less likely.
Now, there is a possible way of making it more appealing for young families to move to Cowley County in the future.
It seems that all of the stories about reducing manpower are about losing middle management and increasing labor.
By my way of looking at things that would mean a lower average payroll. And, isn't that the point? For the businesses to save money?
In our manufacturing jobs, you cannot reduce labor except by replacing it with machinery. I'm sure they are doing their best to create the best situation (and to stay in business).
It's a wonder that so many people with little or no experience second-guess these companies. Maybe they are still here because they do know best.
I'll bet most of Ark City will be up in arms over that. It seems that everyone here knows far more than anyone else.
Particularly when you take general information from an article and try to pin it on a specific company. One size fits all?
"Unified school District 470... includes the fine folks in Parkerfield, Silverdale and the other outlying townships and county residents who are within the boundary of USD470"
So maybe a population of 15,000?
Every man woman and child paying $35.00 per year is only $525,000.00 and that is not even close to the $1.5 million that will have to be paid.
I don't understand the argument.
Are you saying the bill is not $1.5 million per year?
Are you saying the residential property in Ark City will pay $1.5 million per year? At $35.00 per house rate? How?
Are you saying that Parkerfield and Silverdale make up the $1.3 million dollar per year difference where Ark City pays about $197,000?
Is industry picking up the tab?
These numbers are not even close unless there is a "white knight" who will pay almost all of the bill.
Wake up Ark City.
The first step was saying it would cost Ark City residents $17.5 million when it really will cost them $30 million.
Now it is saying a $35.00 per house bill.
You will remember this when you get the REAL bill.
The first step was saying it would cost Ark City residents $17.5 million when it really will cost them $30 million.
Its not that simple.
The $35 is on an average house, valued at $75 for homeowners.
The thing is paid by property taxes. This would include vacant lots, and fields out of town. It also includes businesses, which pay at a higher rate than residential customers do.
So the businesses at Strother Field will be chipping in to help pay for it.
To break it down, you would have to look at all the businesses as well.
Ooops
i meant to say
The $35 is on an average house, valued at $75,000 for homeowners.
So, I'm looking at my last tax bill.
It shows "revenue from property tax levies" (USD 470):
Gen Fund 1.2 million
Bond and In 0.386 million
Other 1.408 million
Recreation .479 million
It looks to me that for it to be $35.00 the increase on the property tax levy would have to be about $250,000 per year. Who gets the bill for the other $1,250,000.00?
I thought the total was paid by property tax levies. I didn't know there was another source. What is it?
THE SCHOOL BOND ISSUE IS A FARCE< IT IS CONTRIVED OF LIES AND MISSINFORMATION, ~~~~ BEWARE~~~~~ VOTE NO NOW AND MAIL YOU VOTE IN,, YOUR PROPERTY TAXS WILL DOUBLE IN 2010,, NOT JUST ON YOUR HOUSE BUT YOUR BOAT CAR AND BARN, RENTAL PROPERTIES WILL TRIPPLE IN TAX COST,, THOSE WITH INVESTMENTS WILL SEE THERE STATE TAXS INCREASE BY 8% IF YOU VOTE YES````` VOTE NO NOW11 THE ECONOMY IS IN DIRE STRAITS AND SOON THIS CHEEP MONEY WILL TURN INTO 33% INTREST THT WILL BREAK YOU AND YOUR SCHOOL DISTRICT><><>< DO NOT FALL FOR THE CHEEP MONEY IDEA,, THE RESSESION IS UPON US
wow finaly someone who sounds like they have done their homework, I am voteing no because i am on a fixed budget
I am voteing no also,, it dose nothing for the Christan schools in town, and they need more room than the public schools
good point I also am voteing no
sock-puppet
It's spelled "voting"
Maybe we need the school thing more than we think.
I am also a sock pupet and i am voting yes why would anyone vote no it so stupid to not give the mexicans more room in our schools,, they are human also
I agree we should support the immigrants in our community and use our tax money wisely even if they are not contributeing, if we educate them they can go back home and make thier country better, who cares if we lose a few million dollars its just money,, i really dont care about seniors on fixed incomes i want to make sure the mexicans are educated
I spoke to a few school board members and got the feeling that they really do not support this issue, i think they felt that it is the doing of just a small group and is very bad for the overall condition of our schools, i also will be choseing NO as my tally,, call me a sock puppet also, i can think for myself and do not need to be a sheep in the flock running towards the cliff
your an idiot, vote yes change this bible belt town to Creationism realism
I agree the idea that one man designed all life is stupid, vote yes and lets teach our children evolution and intelligent thinking,, the more money we pump into the system the further out we can bring culture and real world thinking to our area
Look at YOUR tax bill.
Is anybody paying $35.00 for USD 470 "Bond and Interest" on their taxes now?
The total amount on the bill for Bond and Interest is $381,000
The new bond and interest will be $1.5 million per year, more than the current bond. It won't be cheaper.
Maybe it is worth it, but why the shell game with the pricetag?
VOTE NO NOW11 THE ECONOMY IS IN DIRE STRAITS AND SOON THIS CHEEP MONEY WILL TURN INTO 33% INTREST THT WILL BREAK YOU AND YOUR SCHOOL DISTRICT><><>< DO NOT FALL FOR THE CHEEP MONEY IDEA,, THE RESSESION IS UPON US
>>>
This is poppycock.
recessions are born of fear, not of reality.
it will cost the average tax payer $35 more a year, period .. .thast all
half is being paid by the state, and you do pay state taxes, so there is more there... but ... but.
state taxes wont change whether or not the bond issue passes.
$35 a year isnt much..
you spend more than that on one fun trip to wichita ...
the fear tactics bother me.
if there is some reality, show it :)
it is about building schools...
about replacing 50 year old heating and air systems ..
we have what its really for on our web site
"if there is some reality, show it :)"
I'm paying more than 35 bucks now on the current bond + interest. It shows $381,000 on the bill. The new bond + interest is $1,500,000.
There is nothing to indicate that the new bond will be apportioned any differently than the current one or that the mill rate would be disproportionate to the current bond.
It will cost more.
Reality.
James you seem to know what a poppycock looks like
not funny joke
back to issues
Going back to the visionaries ideas, have any of you been to Atchison,KS, Weston,KS, or Parkville, MO? They are all small towns that have made a name for themselves by becoming a destination for antique/home goods/shopping for stuff that not everyone carries kind of people. They are all relatively close to Kansas City, but they by no means are easy to get to. Ark City could even think in that kind of direction and get people from Wichita/Ponca/Tulsa/OKC to come shop. I've heard comments from shop owners in the places mentioned above they even have people coming up from OKC to shop for the weekends. All 3 places also have converted some of their historic homes (which AC has quite a few of) into Bed and Breakfasts. The "quaint" factor goes along way with people looking for shopping out of town. Just some more to think about.
Oh, and Parkville is next to a river, so they've done a lot of touristy things with that as well.
So what if the hike bike trails ended up as a simple recreational area with some really nice RV pads, hookups and bathrooms -like those at the lakes with showers etc. Then an open area - somewhere with a Bandshell or an outdoor stage?
With the intent to schedule a Summer concert series - bluegrass, rock n roll, christian and the season culmunating with:
Me in my lawn chair, strawhat, reebox, shorts, tank top and shades - eating a steak, brat or 1 inch pork chop with fries from a mobile vendor and a large glass of ice cold tea. While listening to the great sounds of the Wichita, Tulsa, or Kansas City Symphony on a warm afternoon/evening! A talent worthy of a great crowd of all ages!
Professional musicians in an outdoor setting - The acoustics of the Arkansas River - Priceless!
I am not sure you could afford or attract one of those talents - or that they would come!
But if one did?
um, whoever that was that is confusing this bond issue with the curriculum is a complete nitwit. there is no correlation whatsoever. this has NOTHING to do with curriculum or even how smart our kids are. it has do with with infrastructure. infrastructure may play a minor role in helping to educate our kids, but it sure will not make them any smarter. if they are not as hot in the summer or cold in the winter, they might have a better environment within which to concentrate. that has been said over an over. I guess all of the kids who grew up before we had heat and air systems and when we only had single pane windows must have been really poor students with no brains in their heads. a lot of folks talk about how discouraging and embarrassing curry field is. our current tax structure is what is embarrassing. they say to fix what we have would cost too much. that is not true. it will cost something to update what we have, but it will not have to be 6 million or even 4.5 million. one of the arguments is that if we had just done the maintenance needs all along we would not be in the shape we are in now. there is a lot of truth to that but upgrades are necessary also. maintenance alone does not take care of the condition the bathrooms are in. paint and new tile does not make a bathroom ada compliant. but guess what. making bathrooms ada compliant does not cost millions either. fixing the bleachers. do we have a cost to fix them? why is everything to the point where the only way you can fix something is to replace it? the price tags all came from one source. why trust just one source? so what if they gave their advice for free? is it really free just because you do not have to pay for it up front. believe it. they will get a nice cut if this goes through. there are better ways to skin cats. some people in this community and others actually save up for things in advance and bite things off in pieces at a time rather than the have to have it now mentality. one thing about it all that kills me besides the less than reliable numbers coming from all sides is that all of this is so necessary despite a sideway or declining population. there are those who say this needs to happen because the ed. system is what people shopping for a community look at first. check out the ratings the schools are receiving. they are doing a great job right now and it does not take 36 million or 60 million or however many millions to make them better. how do you measure return on investment for something like that when the schools are already rated well. I am glad they have their standard and poor's rating too because that means they might be using what monies they do have in a wise fashion. how is that any different from what we should have as a basic expectation for any of our governing bodies? if we really wanted to make a good investment in the community we would be voting to spend 36 million dollars on a new hospital. and if it really is 60 million instead of 36 million, maybe the remainder could be used to consolidate some schools and rehab the existing hospital so it can be used for other purposes.
There are some really good Branson shows to see!
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