Commissioners talked a long time about the water bill thing and the crash report thing.
They will likely be changed some.
One thing to realize is, that you do not have to pay the crash report fee. It is voluntary.
The insurance companies are asked to pay, and about half do, chief Wallace said.
Some companies send it back to the person who was at fault.
Wallace says no one will go after the person to pay, it wont be turned over to a collection agency etc.
On the water bills. Lane Massey said since this connection and shutoff fee went into effect, a lot fewer people are failing to pay their bill.
There were more people late last month, but the number of shutoffs were cut in half.
So if its getting people to pay, then maybe its not so bad.
But they are considering cutting the amount of the charge, and are going to not charge if a non profit - such as salvation army or a church - is paying the bill.
They talked over 4 hours.
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So, just as I supposed, folks will be calling the churches and the salvation army to have their water bills paid. (cause you're not gonna charge the non-profits to pay the excess????) Does that really sound right to you.
NOT TO ME!!!!!
People are calling churches and the salvation army, and other agencies, NOW. And have been for years.
Some people make the rounds every month, some really in need, some not.
It sounds like they are not going to charge the extra fee to the non profits so that the non profits can help more people. What part of helping people don't you like.
That is a silly game. Sending Police Department bills to people, but then they don't have to pay them. Is this tactic something the collection agency came up with?
I'm surprised that Chief Wallace would be a part of such nonsense and try to explain it all away.
Let's get real for a moment. The company that sold the idea to Wallace and sends the bills out IS A COLLECTION AGENCY. THAT IS ALL THEY DO.
It will be 3 months before they forget about this "don't really have to pay" fantasy and go back to business as usual. Or just quietly start aggressive collections anyway. The targets don't live in Ark City and who would know anyway?
ACPD has fallen for their slick sales tactics and foolishness once again.
Really, who would get a bill from a police department and not feel threatened to pay it? (maybe arrested if they don't)
The only way it wouldn't be dishonest trickery is to include a clear notice with all bills that says that the payment is voluntary and does not have to be paid. But that will never happen.
This whole thing is dumber than dumb. It is time to shut it down permanently now.
Why is the ACPD even involved in such tomfoolery anyway?
What is there about the crash tax that promotes the theme that most law enforcement agencies profess? "To protect and serve" Only here it is To protect and serve" "for a fee". Call the county deputies or the state troopers. They won't charge you near as much to work your accidents!!!
@ February 3, 2009 7:58 AM
+1! You said exactly what I was going to say when I clicked over here to comment.
This outside agency will likely be sending out threatening sounding letters and calling on the phone to try to collect this fee, just as any other collection agency would. I bet the word "voluntary" never comes up.
It sounds like they are not going to charge the extra fee to the non profits so that the non profits can help more people. What part of helping people don't you like.
February 3, 2009 5:35 AM
I'm sorry you misunderstood my post, I am not saying that I wouldn't help the people. What I was saying is that if they can do that for non-profit groups, then they can work with the people themselves.
What is really interesting is there is no legal requirement for local law enforcement officials to work a vehicle accident. The only legal requirement applies to the drivers involved in the accident. They are required to report it to KDOT. This is why some insurance companies are willing to pay for the investigation.
There is also no legal requirement for a police officer to bend over and pick up a drowning baby from a swimming pool. They would hopefully do THAT without an extra charge though.
"Wallace was shown a bill for more than $600 that someone received. Wallace said that bill was too high and he said he needed to address that with the company."
How interesting! The police department doesn't know how much the collection company is billing the drivers! How screwed up is that?
Who is in charge at the Police Department?
Sounds like a collection agency is in charge.
To me it's political suicide to try and enforce such a rediculus idea of collecting a fee for investigations. I've seen how much work the Police do at an accident, and it sure doesn't account for a bill to be sent! Lets see here, the fire dept doesn't charge for cutting someone out of a car when they use the jaws for life, or for washing down the oils that spill from the cars after they wreck, nor does the sheriffs dept charge for helping with traffic control, nor the traveler for showing up and taking a picture of the crash! Whats next???
Does the fire dept charge for investigating a fire you had from your trash barrels getting loose? Uhh, NO, I believe they call that part of their job!!! And thats after they put it out!!!!!
You can bet I'll warn everyone I know whose from out of town that they don't have to pay this bill, and that just maybe, they should think about it a little more before driving in AC.
Wait till someone's grandma who is on a fixed income gets shut off then goes without because she is too proud to go through the degredation you are talking about going to the churchs. She can barely pay her bill, but the reconnect just keeps it off longer. Funny you mention the church thing. I happen to work for one of the churches that people come in to get assistance. Want to know what they need it on more than any other bill? Water. Want to know the average monthly bill (which is doubled by the time they get to us) $125-150. just for one month. Seriously. For water. You say that it cut down the number of people behind...well it has increased local aid signifigantly already and we haven't even got to the cutoffs yet this month. Further, you can believe me when I say the process a person must go through to get this assistance is purely humiliating being forced to go from church to church and being degraded every step of the way. They only pay a small portion per church and usually visit with you about your religious needs at each one. While we try to be nice as possible, the process of it is still brutal. And really, has it became the churches responsibility to line the city's pockets just so they can bring in more money? So what that they are saying they won't charge the extra fees to the churches? The churches are paying for more people's utilities than was let on at that meeting I can promise you. Where is the legality of any of that? What intelligent person would think that it is efficient or humane to charge the kind of money they passed for a person already in such a difficult situation that they are facing losing their water supply? How easy it was for them to excuse economic hardship and sell the idea of irresponsible junky casino losers as the ones not paying- the sad fact is that it is the people on fixed incomes that have taken all the increases in bills without pay increases that they can take. They are stretched to the limit and this could easily be the last straw that breaks them. What is wrong with the picture? Surely no Godly person could see this as a solution. People are already giving up on dental care and prescriptions, eating cheap unhealthy food in order to survive and living in darkened rooms trying to conserve energy. What is wrong with people that they have forgotten the importance of basic human needs. It is disgusting and the people in charge of the explotation of these resources should be ashamed of themselves. If there were other water resources you can bet that they would lose every ounce of business of the working class person.
It's amazing to me that we live between two rivers and pay so much for water.
i think the water deal is bullshit theres plenty of hard workin familys that have to support more than 4 that get a water bill thats 130 dollars or more and with a family of four or more thats hard to keep up with after the other companys that get u for gas elec rip u off. I thought the tax payers were the ones in charge not the shity 3 that have made the city worse since being elected
I have to agree with you on charging the poor already struggling families so much for their water. It is really a catch 22 for the poor. The law is they have to keep their children fed, housed, clothed and water and utilities on to keep their children. Then food, clothing, taxes, schooling, gasoline, electricity, water, and natural gas go up so high they can't keep up with it all. Now mix that in with the low paying jobs found in this county and THEN the city ads charges on top of all the above and make it hard for the poor to survive. I agree with the church employee that says that the commission is out of touch with what is really going on with the poor in this city. Too bad they can't have the option to buy water from the Rural water systems. It is much cheaper.It is easy to make your own rules when there are no other options.
How about if we vote to cut some of the city's administrations salaries? Dept heads etc? I think if they were in the same boat as many of us are in, then they may take a second look at some of these issues!!! I mean seriously, why are we paying so much for such crappy decisions being forced on us? Typical Liberal Democrates. Always wanting someone else to pay the cost and expense of what they consider to be their brilliant ideas then except the responsibiliy also when they don't work out!
As far as I'm concerned, Wallace is on his way out and very well should be for even trying to impose such a voluntery fee on people during these times whether they are from out of town or not. Another typical Backwoods Liberal Democrat without a clue.
Excellent idea about cutting the city administrator's salary- but how is that done? Do taxpayers even have that say? I would vote for it in a heartbeat. People with unrealistic salaries certainly do not understand what a fixed income is. They are way to removed from reality to understand the choice a person makes between food and medical care, water or warmth. Totally clueless to another persons needs- but hey- at least they will sleep warm with a full belly- while my child goes without and I get threatened by SRS because I can't afford their high priced water.
I know everyone is upset with the crash report bills, as am I. But, please when you mention these don't refer to the problem as ACPD, trust me I have spoke with alot of the officers and they to do nto agree with it. However they have to do as they are told to do as are any of us, if our bosses tell us to. The whole thing sucks, but the Police Department is not the badguy here.
Yeah, everyone knows it is Wallace, and not his officers, who has pushed this money grabbing scheme on us. Most of the officers are against it.
Hey I've got a great idea. Why don't all the poor people move to Winfield in protest?!?
There's part of your problem, poor people really can't afford to up and move because the cost of moving, usually a deposit on a rental house, don't forget the cost of switching utilities. Anyone who can't afford it is STUCK and the big guys know it!
Another thing, how's the dems to blame on this one as one person posted. Seems to me the dems are usually for giving the little guys a break? Now don't blast me on this comment, I never trully understood some of the differences with the liberal dems and conservative republicans. I vote for who's ideas I like, no matter what party it is.
@February 3, 2009 6:43 PM
Thanks
Hey I've got a great idea. Why don't all the poor people move to Winfield in protest?!?
February 5, 2009 10:23 AM
How about you pay for them to be able to relocate...they probably would. What a smarta$$ solution.
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