I had a professor in seminary who used to say. "It's easier to go to a consistent extreme than to stay in the middle of Biblical tension."
I think this is true in the world at large as well.
People naturally want to go to extremes, especially if they don't understand what is going on, or sometimes even if they do.
There are issues where the bible is not clear, so people gravitate to the extremities of possibility. It's the same with the high school.
There are conflicting reports.
The two extremes here are that the high school is an inner city war zone or a place of tremendous peace. If you think about it, you have to admit neither is true.
You would think that if it was all that bad there, we would have people contacting us all the time. We have not. Not even last week. All the people we talked to, we called or contacted. Even though I asked people to contact us.
I do think something happened. Based on the evidence I have seen, I think it was something that was taken care of. That doesn't mean it will never happen again or that there will never be any violence.
School officials could have communicated better. They should have.
At the same time, there are kids who would do something like make a threat just to make the schools shut down for a day. You cannot shut down the schools every time someone makes a threat. Having more security seemed to work.
There are discipline problems at all schools. It is getting worse as our society deteriorates and gets away from its Godly roots (let the anti-religion attacks begin). School officials can't do anything about that.
The problem of increased violence is not unique to a school. It is more a societal problem.
I think we can make a difference, but being an alarmist is not the answer. Hiding your head in the sand isn't either.
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36 comments:
I have to wonder what it would take to get the youth to want to go to school? It seems that it might be more of a Social Event than an educational one. The fact they don't see that their education determines their future is lost to only the events of today!
I have a relative who is a Principal in the KCK area. She has been appointed to several of the most difficult Grade Schools.
To make a long story short. We had a fairly lenghty conversation in a surgical waiting room waiting the outcome of the surgery of a relative.
She was telling stories of the problems she had encountered as a Pricipal. In one instance she had a problem with a child who was disruptive to the whole class.
She went to the class room and sent the whole class out of the room except for the disruptive party. Dealt with him one on one!
It was then decided the the child was to be only allowed to use the bathroom at the Nurse station and not with the rest of the students as well as other things to isolate the individual. ("Cut them out of the herd")
In the end the child wanted to be returned to the group and was willing to do anything to comply.
That probably won't work with older age groups. But, what would it take to get them to see that the things they really want are worth the effort! I think we have to help them find their way!
"There are discipline problems at all schools. It is getting worse as our society deteriorates and gets away from its Godly roots (let the anti-religion attacks begin). School officials can't do anything about that."
Godly roots have nothing to do with our spanish speaking population explosion, which is the real reason for our new found problems. Not your god (or lack thereof).
Its a ticking time bomb about to go off.
I have been a teacher for over 25 years. When I started teaching, I did not have problems with students being disrespectful toward me or to other teachers and administrators. Parents expected their children to go to school and learn. They were supportive of the teachers and if their children were not doing well, it was not automatically the teacher's fault. In the last 10 years things have changed. When I contact parents to let them know their son or daughter is failing, I get one of 2 responses:"Thanks for letting me know. I will see what I can do to help." or "I know. We are having problems with him/her at home. I don't know what to do." Unfortunately, I hear the second reponse more often than the first.
Somewhere along the way, we have failed to instill in our children the basic idea that self-discipline is necessary for success. We have to teach them to be responsible for their own actions and not bail them out every time they have a little problem. We have to expect them to do their job. If they are school age, their job should be to go to school prepared to learn and not to disrupt class with their actions.
Unfortuanlately, too many high school students go to school only to socialize. They come to class without book, paper or pens. They don't do any assigned homework because they don't have time. Some come to school so tired they have trouble staying awake in class. I realize that some students have to work to help support their families, but many work to pay for nonessentials.
I firmly believe that discipline starts at home. Maybe if it did, we would see less violence at school.
How many parents know who their children hang out with? Do they know who their children text (often during classtime)? How many parents text or call their students during classtime? I wonder what would happen if I called them or texted them at work? How many times would I have to do that before thier bosses took notice? How many parents read their myspace or facebook pages? Do they check up on them to make sure they are where they say they are? Have they required their children to call them via a land line as opposed to a cell phone to prove they are where they say they are? How many parents have checked the pictures their kids send and receive on their cell phones? I think a number of parents would get a wakeup call if they did any of the above.
I did all of the above. It did not make my children angels, but it did let them know that I cared and that I had certain expectations of them. I have made them delete myspace and facebook comments and pictures, held their cell phones hostage till grades came up, made them quit jobs that took away from needed study time,grounded them from fun activities when they broke the rules, and encouraged them to participate in school activites that I felt like were worthwhile.
They knew the consequences that they would face at home if they were disrespectful to a teacher, disrupted a class, or were involved with gangs, drugs, alcohol or any other illegal activities. We had battles because I am strict and they rebeled.
I know it was worth it though. Several years ago my son wrote from college to tell me how much he appreciated that fact that we cared enough to make him follow the rules. He said he was the envy of many of his because he and his parents were close.
I talked with three high school kids this morning in church, and one teacher.
They all said the same thing.
There were some fights but it was under control.
they all feel safe at school.
Soooo just who has enough money to pay off these people to keep telling me this stuff?
Is this a line item in the school budget you think?
I agree with the post above. My daughter just got her cell phone, ipod and laptop back whn grades came out last time, after being grounded from them all summer because of bad grades last year. She was treating school as a social scene instead of a place of learning.
It was amazing that she survived the summer without those important essential to teenage life, but She has learned her lesson from it I think.
...and when I said the post above, it was not JJ's. Not that I NEVER agree with him, just that I don't in this case. I think he is downplaying it, or at least not taking the fear that these students had into account.
The perception of danger is just as big a problem as actual danger. If someone points a gun at your head, it doesn't matter if it's loaded (capable of doing harm) or not, it's what you believe that counts. It's aggravated Assault either way. It's all about perception. Something you should take into account before you climb up on your soapbox.
Mr. Editor,
How can we expect your reporting to be any less than biased toward the administration, and maintaining the status quo?
You have already made up your mind.
There isn't a problem, and everything is wonderful in happyville.
Again I ask you. What does the discipline matrix say about the problem. What kind of infractions are happening, and how often.
Are the numbers lower because they are handling more of the problems "internally?" I haven't looked at the numbers in a couple of years, but the FACT is that in 2004- 2005, Ark City had the highest rate of violent acts per 100 students in the entire state of Kansas, exceding the state average by almost 10 times. Even if we are to believe that violent incidents are trending down, I doubt seriously that they have improved enought to say that it still isn't a serious problem.
I don't wan't to be all doom and gloom, and to be certain, there are many positive things happening in Ark City. Academically, other districts can't hold a candle to us, our FFA program is one of the best in the country, and as anyone who attend the musical can attest to, our drama program is 2nd to none. What
does it hurt to admit there is a problem, and come together to solve it. I am not irrational, or an alarmist. I have not lied or exaggerated in any of the posts I have made on this board. Violence and bullying is a common occurence at both the High School, and Middle School. Students are disrespectful, and openly defiant, and little is done to stop it. There have been fights, many fights. Students have been injured. Teachers have been assaulted. The fighting has become a spectator sport. Kids are streaming out of class to watch them. We need to restore order and discipline to our schools. Perhaps, anyone who leaves class to watch a fight should be suspended. Perhaps it is time to consider uniforms, perhaps it is time to remove the offenders and send them to the alternative school. The administration knows who they are, lets start dealing with them.
I had always wondered how you came to be editor at th paper, now I know its because you know who's ass to kiss mr. holier than thou. You are very arrogant to tell me what is happening with my kids when you don't attend or have kids who attend that school. No, everybody wasn't involved, but innocent kids got pulled in. My guess is the kids you chose to ask where in different parts of the building. My daughter wasn't and I don't appreciate your attitude all lackadaisy like you know everything- please admit it- you don't- and if my daughter found it upsetting because it was right outside her classroom (and it was)- just down the hall from the offices and not where you reported it to be in the lunchroom- it is not for you to say it didn't exist.
I don't think the teachers have time to discipline kids no more, since that have to worry about such and such awards. Passing this, passing that, thanks to the no child left behind act.
I also talked with several students, and a few parents at church this morning. They all spoke in hushed tones about
"those people," or the "blacks," and "mexicans" that are causing all the problems. These are otherwise good decent people, but it is obvious that racism runs deep in our community.
What gets me is that the fight in itself had racial targets. I hear it was the blacks vs. the Mexicans. If white students had been involved, it would have been a "hate" crime. Now that white people are upset with the blacks and Mexicans which caused this scene, they are all racist.
JJ, I do not believe you are lieing about what people are telling you. I think people are afraid to go on the record, and they know talking to you is doing such. I do not want you to print "rumors" in our paper. However, I wish people would come forward and tell the truth about what they know. I believe the school schould have come forward about this incident and made a statement to parents immediately, whether they believed it to be a viable threat or not. Now that they failed to do this, it will take a long time for parents to trust them with their kids safety.
If the problem in our schools is an "isolated incident," as the administration claims it is, perhaps they should prove it by surveying teachers and students at both the Middle School and High School, and then making the results public. It is a win win situation. Either it will put all the rumors to rest, or uncover a deeper problem that needs to be adressed, (and that can never be a bad thing.) If cost is an issue, I would be willing to help raise the funds necessary to pay for the surveys.
The following links are from the Kansas Department of Education, and are some examples of surveys that could be used.
http://www.ksde.org/KS_SAFE_SCHOOLS_RESOURCE_CENTER/GoddardParentSurvey.pdf
http://www.ksde.org/KS_SAFE_SCHOOLS_RESOURCE_CENTER/SchoolWideBullyingSurvey.pdf
http://nces.ed.gov/programs/crime/pdf/principal/schlViolence.pdf
I would urge everyone reading this blog to contact Dr. Ballard and respectfully ask for a comprehensive survey to be conducted regarding bullying and violence.
He may be reached by email at:
ron.ballard@usd470.com
Or by phone at:
TELEPHONE: 620-441-2000
FAX: 620-441-2009
m- it is not for you to say it didn't exist.
>>>>
IVe never said that.
Ive said over and over that something DID happen.
Im just saying I need more collaboration ..
everyone i talk to who actually goes to the school is saying its being over blown by a few people .
this includes students and teachers.
then i have people on here saying its really bad, and even in public, but the people in public have never actually been to the school.
Ok, ill make you a deal.
COme to my office and tell me exactly what you have seen with your eyes and i wont use your name. or tell anyone your name.
BUt I do need it verified for my own sense of justice.
Editor said:
Ok, I,ll make you a deal.
Come to my office and tell me exactly what you have seen with your eyes and i wont use your name. or tell anyone your name.
But I do need it verified for my own sense of justice.
JJ, you still miss the point. Come to my office, expect to remain anonymous. A real newspaper "person" will get out from behind the desk, pound the pavement and track it down. Oh I forgot "newspapers" aren't the voice of the community anymore, it's about selling adverstising. [City and school buys quite a bit don't they]. [Little wonder William Allen is turning over in his grave].
"I also talked with several students, and a few parents at church this morning. They all spoke in hushed tones about
"those people," or the "blacks," and "mexicans" that are causing all the problems. These are otherwise good decent people, but it is obvious that racism runs deep in our community."
So, it's racist to say that the mexicans and blacks are the ones fighting and causing a problem, EVEN IF IT'S TRUE??
What should they say then, that there was a group of non distinct persons fighting with another group of non distinct persons?
If a red car sideswipes you and drives away, is it racist to tell the cops it was a red car, or should you say non distinct car?
If a white man grabs your purse and runs away, is it racist to tell the police that the man was white? How about black or latino?
Everyone in this town has had to deal with the large hispanic population growth in one way or another, and the gang scene, whether wannabes or full fledged bangers, is just another thing they have brought with them.
It's not racist to point out the facts. If it were white kids fighting white kids, then I'm sure they would have said so, and I bet you wouldn't have cried RACISM at that.
"Academically, other districts can't hold a candle to us.."
BS.
ACHS is in the bottom third of the state in Math. Just average in reading.
I get really tired hearing people make up stuff about how great the schools are doing. Time for truth instead of BS press releases.
A real newspaper "person" will get out from behind the desk, pound the pavement and track it down.
>>>
I have done that, and told you what i found out.
You just choose to not believe me.
I get really tired hearing people make up stuff about how great the schools are doing. Time for truth instead of BS press releases.
>>>
The number are readily available on the state dept of ed web site...
look it up for yourself
but youll say they are lying too :)
Nope.
Look it up yourself. www.schoolmatters.com
They refer to them when they get awards, but are silent when it comes to scores.
Nationwide, nearly 282,000 students are physically assaulted each month.
The Department of Justice estimates that nearly 25% of our nations school children will be abused/assaulted this month.
16% of children report that they are currently being bullied, and 35% report that they do not feel safe in school.
Why do we believe Ark City is immune from all of this?
By the schools own admission, there were nearly 300 reported instances of violence at Ark City Middle School for the 2003-2004, 2004 -2005 school years.
In 2004, Ark City Middle School had a reported 16.9 violent incidents per 100 students, compared to a statewide average of 1.4 per 100 students. This was more than 12 times the state average. This information was taken directly from the Kansas Department of Education School Report Card.
Not surprisingly, this information is no longer available online.
Arkansas City has some of the highest poverty rates in Kansas.
Poverty places children at risk.
Poverty breeds both bullies, and victims of bullying.
Many children in our school system come from broken homes, where drugs, violence and neglect are a way of life.
For many, the hours spent at school are the best part of their day. School should be a safe haven. A refuge for our children, but all too often it is not.
School should be a place for our children to learn and to grow. But too many of our children worry instead about whether they can safely enter a bathroom or locker room, what hall they can walk down, where they can sit at lunch, or whether they’ll be beat up on the bus, or walking to or from school.
It is not a “harmless right of passage,” or a case of “boys will be boys,” and left unaddressed, it will breed long term problems including: Poor Grades, Low Self Esteem, Depression/Anxiety, and Suicide.
Wow. ACHS is NOT doing that well according to that website, niether is Winfield HS.
The elementary seems to be doing quite well, but by the time it reaches HS, oops.....
I wonder what we focus on as time goes by, apparently it is NOT the educational values one would like to think.
That was a sad report to look at.
(all the way around)
Although I said we were doing well academically,I should have said, we have a solid curriculum, and dedicated, qualified teachers.
Obviously, there isn't much learning going on. It's difficult to teach in such a disruptive, disrespectful atmosphere.
My husband and I were just discussing last night how our boys tell us every day how someone has gotten in trouble in school. There is always at least one and usually more. It has become normal. We expect to hear this. However, looking back, I do not remember students getting in trouble every day in our classrooms when we were in school. It happened every once in a while, but not every day. We're talking grade school, here.
Am I just not remembering right or are the teachers dead on? Many of them have told me the kids are out of control. Many feel their hands are tied.
The first step to resolving any problem is to recognize it exists.
USD 470 has been giving themselves awards and sending out press releases about how well the schools are doing, and ignoring the performance levels for decades.
Most attending these award ceremonies probably believe that all is OK.
It is fine to be a cheerleader, but the coach can't just pay attention to the cheerleaders. He has to look at the win/loss.
It is time for USD 470 to face reality about the Middle School and the High School.
Poor discipline is just a symptom of deeper problems.
I dont see how their getting awards relates to this.
they could get awards and still have big discipline problems.
the fighting doesnt diminish the awards, and the awards dont make the fights ok.
Propaganda to make poor performance seem exceptional.
Propaganda to make poor performance seem exceptional.
>>
Wow, getting a national award, and state awards to hide poor performance.
Thats pretty sneaky alright.
A real newspaper "person" will get out from behind the desk, pound the pavement and track it down.
>>>
I have done that, and told you what i found out.
You just choose to not believe me.
November 16, 2008 8:18 PM
You were limited in who you chose to talk to then James. Your opinions are biased to the point you regurgetated what Alisha Call said-she doesn't work IN the school she's at central office- not what is going on at the school...shame shame on you!
not what is going on at the school...shame shame on you!
>>>
I talked with kids on skateboards, i talked to kids at church, i stopped kids walking down the street, i asked a kid at dillons.
i did not know most of them. they all said the same thing...
all of them were at the school every day last week.
"Wow, getting a national award, and state awards to hide poor performance.
Thats pretty sneaky alright."
It's like junior baseball where all the kids taht show up get a ribbon.
It is the paper's job to cut through the stuff and question performance instead of saying "well, they got an award, everything at the schools are great!"
The traveller has not been doing that.
Most of the kids on skate boards are at the middle school- you didn't know them blah blah-...face it you didn't do your homework and now you are being called to the carpet and are not even big enough a man to admit you were wrong- parents deserved to know what was happening and you saying we didn't was foolish. I for one would have trusted them if they had told me what they were doing, in fact I would have appreciated it and felt protected.
instead of saying "well, they got an award, everything at the schools are great!"
The traveller has not been doing that.
>>>
COme on people, give me a break.
I said yesterday that you could have problems AND get awards. The two things are mutually exclusive.
How about you saying the awards dont count.
I asked the skateboarders, and found some that were in high school.
How is talking to 20 or so students and about 10 teachers not doing my homework.
We have reported both sides of the issue.
Just because i dont take your alarmist side doesnt make me biased.
Maybe I am seeing through your smokescreen. I think your real problem is that you dont like for both sides of the story to be told.
Ive said several times, and ill say it again.
THERE WERE FIGHTS LAST WEEK
PEOPLE GOT IN TROUBLE OVER IT
Id like for you to tell me how that is denying there were any problems.
It is the paper's job to cut through the stuff and question performance instead of saying "well, they got an award, everything at the schools are great!"
>>>
If a football team goes 10-0, wins its region and is heading for the playoffs, ... that should be a pretty good indication.
The high school got an award that only 10 schools from the entire nation get ... i guess they made that up too eh.
Show me when or where I have said "everything" is great ..
Thats right. You were completely in the right here. Fairly reporting- yep- please try not to break your arm patting your self rightous self on the back. You just can't admit that you don't know what is best for my kids can you but yet you act like you are all knowing and parents are just babbling idiots. Glad you are living through your strong christian beliefs James, I'm sure the Lord is proud.
You just can't admit that you don't know what is best for my kids can you but yet you act like you are all knowing and parents are just babbling idiots.
>>
Ive never said anything about any of that.
Youre the only one that keeps saying that.
youre arguing with yourself here.
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